Trolling at night - Forums Archive

yak2you2

2008-10-07 13:37:06

I've expieremented with this one a little bit over the years, caught a few but not really what you would call market quantities. Tried some glow in the dark stuff, messed around with the J-plugs with the little internal blinking lights, just hav'nt really seen the kind of success I was hoping for. My theory is,,, First, in the winter, most of the good tides are going to be in the dark. Second, when your laying down there in total darkness and can't see a thing, or more specifically havn't eatin a thing in hours and hours, and then this little glowing lure goes flipping by over head, you should have a captive audiance. And third, if your the only guy stupid enough to be out there doing it, you should have them all to yourself, but so far, it just hasn't worked out like I'd hoped. I'm planning on revisiting this one again this year, before I permanently cast it on to my heap ridiculous concepts.

I'm just curious if anyone has any insight?? My worst fear is,,, If it was to be a viable means of landing fish, wouldn't someone have developed it years ago. I'm sure it's all been tried, you just don't hear much about guys loading the checkers at 2 in the morning. I have read quite a bit about dudes catching them cosistantly where they stack up in front of damns and such down south, so I know they will bite in the dark, I just havn't got it dialed in yet. How about external lighting?, i.e.- cyalume sticks, or crab lights? your thoughts are appreciated.

spike christopher

2008-10-07 18:46:35

I have tried it several times and never had any success. The last time being during the second king opening of this year outside of Necter Islands. I fished for several hours after total darkness. I did catch one king at the last of the light but that was it. No problems with the black sea bass and turbots biting. Several years ago I trolled through the entire night right on to day break and never caught a thing. This took place on a long drag from Yakobi Rock to Graves Harbor. I believe after dark the salmon come to a stand still and just maintain in the water column, that is why a lot of times you see the effects of shark teeth marks on the tails of the salmon. I think that the sharks are able to sneak up on the fish and grab them from behind. The pupil of the salmon eye is pretty small compared to that of a halibut or shark etc. Just my thoughts.

yak2you2

2008-10-07 20:02:44

i have caught a few, but it was always on a clear, full moon night, with the kind of light that you could almost read a book by. I haven't ever caught one in total blackness, but I want to. I don't think they're dormant all night. During the winter months your talking about laying dormant for 18 out 24 hours, your getting pretty close to hibernation. I'm just guessing that they need more calories than what they're able to find in the day light. I know from my experience as a gillnetter that they do chase feed up against the beach at night. I've gone to my net many, many times at THE crack of dawn, to beat the seals to my catch, and found a fat king in 5 to 10 feet of water all wrapped up dead in my net and stiff. There's no doubt they were chasing feed into the beach in the dark, and got caught. That's why it bugs me so much, I'm convinced that they're moving around, I just haven't been able to get one to bite in total blackness. If you google it, you'll get plenty of articles from river and lake guys claiming to hook them up in the dark. I know a guy who claims that as a crewman on a big power troller they would get up and throw the gear out in total blackness, then go in make breakfast and hangout for a hour or so until first light, then go cycle thru the gear and pick up a couple, but he's been know to stretch his stories, so I don't know. If they do bite, I doubt that it will be any kind of a magic lure that does it, as much as it'll be a style of fishing. I.E.- shining a crab light into the water or something. You gotta admit, it would be kind of cool if you could make it work. Imagine having the big drag all to yourself while everyone else was asleep in the summer, or having the only lit up bait in the ocean during the winter months.

yak2you2

2008-10-16 15:48:40

Come on now,,,, Somebody's gotta have some stories or info about this one..... Let's hear it.

Salty

2008-10-16 18:32:38

I agree, lets hear from some others.

carojae

2008-11-06 17:20:27

I never had a special spoon or hootchie (for after dark) but back in 1988 (I believe) a bunch of us were trolling off surge bay flats and the coho's would start biting at about 7-8PM and we were line loading. This continued for several days.

A few days later on this same bite, the same bunch of boats (including me) were still fishing until 11-12 midnight and past. Totally dark but a hell of a good coho bite.

Navigation systems weren't that great back then so I and some others would anchor inside the green can in front of Deer Harbor. Somebody on here might remember this. Other than that, 1 or 2 fish after dark seems like a sucker fish or just plain luck.

$0.02

Jim

Salty

2008-11-06 17:59:13

I have several after dark stories and even some pictures. But I want to hear from some others first. I have one that includes being naked!!!

carojae

2008-11-06 18:36:34

Does that include your worm? :shock:

Salty

2008-11-06 22:40:43

No pictures, thank god!!

carojae

2008-11-07 04:59:00

Thoughts.

I know it's dark down there most of the time. However, we see feed come to the surface only at night in a lot of cases; I wonder why. You notice this phenomenon more in the winter, in my experience. I don't have a point in asking this, but it is curious.

Another thing. I've fished (probably you too) 50-55 fathom; used black hootchies; caught fish too. My school teacher used to say that light only penetrates to 50feet. I know light goes deeper than that. but I doubt is is light at 50 fathoms. So why would this be diffent according to what the clock says? I dunno. Something to make you think tho. Think about what? I guess it makes you wonder if there is a magic lure.

yak2you2

2008-11-07 05:54:03

well said, I've wondered about some of these very things. I've been diving to 120 ft. here before, and I can tell you that there's plenty of light at least that far down, But I bet your right that it's probably very near dark at 50 to 60 fathoms. Maybe being able to see anything more than a shadow(like a black hootchie) makes it seem some how out of place. Maybe a person should be focusing on a different sensory perception. i.e.- smell, sound, or electrical field. lol! - I like the little $0.02 Carojae, is that your two cents worth?- witty.

Salty

2008-11-07 08:16:20

We are still learning how salmon and other fish see in the low light. It appears that they are more sensitive to the ultraviolet than we are.

yak2you2

2008-11-08 01:26:20

Ok, Let's here what you got on this Eric. The curiosity is killing me, especially the naked story!

Salty

2008-11-08 03:49:08

Back in 1979 I was fishing out of my skiff~~[attachment=2]~~Fishing Scenes_001.jpg[/attachment]

near Gedney Harbor. Trolling was really slow the last week of July and most trollers were working on pinks between Pt. Cosmos and Malmesbury. I had my wife's brother, Dan Prince, about 16, with me. Dan was very susceptible to seasickness so cranking and cleaning humpies in the lump off of Cosmos in Southern Chatham wasn't working out so well.

I noticed that Jerry Beeson, a long time handtroller out of Juneau, who fished out of Gedney, where the buying scow, the NEFCO 11, was located, the last two weeks of July nearly every season, was bringing in some nice numbers of really nice kings. So one day I decided to keep my eye on him and blatantly followed him up to Tebenkof. He was fishing one of my dad's old favorite drags off of Troller Islands.~~[attachment=1]~~Mothers Pictures_001.jpg[/attachment]

He was using two rods with red sinkers and rolling herring as I remember. I knew how to do that, had rods with me and dropped in nearby. It was pretty slow but we caught 4 nice kings and a couple of coho that first day which involved a lot of tying gear, getting the speed right, working the feed, and staying out of Jerry's way. I went and sold that evening in Gedney and was real pleased with the check. Jerry did not show that night. I went back the next morning and as I dropped in he held up two nice kings that he already caught. He shouted over that he was getting them at dawn and dusk. We both went into Gedney that night. I think I had 3 or 4 again while Jerry had about a dozen real nice ones for two days.

So, I tied up to my mothers boat, I Gotta, had a nice dinner and shared with them what I was doing. Bill George advised me that he often had caught kings sport fishing while it was still dark. I got everything ready including baiting up my poles so I could be all ready in the morning.

I was was sleeping lightly when I heard Jerry idling out of the harbor. I looked up, it was still dark, and through the gloom before dawn, saw him hook a fish right in the mouth of Gedney Harbor. I scrambled on deck, still in the sleeping bag, and untied. I started the kicker while still standing in my sleeping bag. Since I had two rods already baited up I decided to throw a line in and then get dressed. (I had learned early to try and have gear in the water as much as possible.)

While I was letting the line out I got a nice king on. There I was, naked, fighting a king in the middle of the harbor while trollers were just starting to get up. I had to turn the kicker off, kick the sleeping bag into the cabin, and try and get the landing net down off of the roof. It was a pretty nice fish so I couldn't horse it in and then get some clothes on. While I was playing the fish I had to be careful to keep my jewels out of the net, away from bait hooks hanging on the rail, and generally try not to moon every awakening troller, including my mother, in the harbor.

Eventually I got the fish into the net and the net and fish into the boat. I did not even conk it before running into the cabin and getting into some clothes. My brother in law never even woke up.~~[attachment=0]~~Dead Fish_001.jpg[/attachment]
We averaged about 5 big kings a day for about a week. It was some of the most fun I ever had trolling. We would get up in the dark, catch one or two, anchor in the middle of the day next to the kelp with the rods out and fish right through dusk which was sometimes good for another fish or two. I will never forget sleeping on the roof during the middle of the day and waking up to the sound of the reel singing and a nice king or coho jumping next to the boat.

yak2you2

2008-11-08 11:23:57

That is a hilariously good story! I've had some semi-similar encounters where I've been on the deck bucket with my pants around my ankles and had a big one hit. Pull up pants, run for gurdy, pants fall down, trip and fall on my face kind of deals :oops: but yours is definitely the best i've ever heard.

Was it absolutely dark at the time? Because I've caught fish before at that first twilight time before dawn, and just after it's gotten so dark that I had to unsnap gear by feel. When I say night, I'm thinking like midnight. Where it would be almost impossible for them to find your gear without artificial help of some kind.

I've been thinking about trying out some different kinds of aromas to try to call them in. Like I said, I know they'll bite by moonlight, so I know there out there cruising around. The whole concept is probably wasted energy that would be better spent in bed, i just can't get the idea out of my head of having a captive audience. If what you had was the only thing in the ocean that they could easily find to eat, either by having it lit up, or smelling like a steak dinner, or sounding like the dinner bell, at a time when they can find nothing else, the theory seems sound that it would give you an edge. Afer reading about Carojae line loading cohos at midnight, I'm a little more inspired, I suppose they were finding the gear by way of the deck lights huh? or, maybe as Eric says what's dark to us may not be to them if their seeing in ultraviolet.

Eric, keep those pictures and stories coming man, you've got some good ones!

Carol W

2008-11-08 16:35:41

Good story Eric, seeing the pic of your handtroller brings back memories of my handtroller that I had in 1979. Mine was a 19 foot Bayliner that I named Tomcod, there are still some guys who took me under their wings call me Tomcod today.

There were some coho's down off West Rock so I ran the Tomcod down to Percy Islands one evening. I had a 120 hp volvo penta for a main and a 10 hp honda for a kicker a couple pipe poles for poles, igloo ice chests for a hold and a plywood bench for a bunk. When I got up the next morning I learned the trollers were going way offshore so not knowing S@$& from shein-ola I followed out to West Rock. The coho were definately biting but as is the case so often down there the water was choppy, and the waves kept washing over the Honda. I finally decided that I had to use the big engine, the coho were biting like i had never experienced before and bing young I was having the time of my life who cared that with each coho the freeboard got lower and water slpped over the rail. I anchored at Percy Islands that night and deciced I would fish the next day until there was not any more room for fish in the boat. That is what I did the next day fish were everywhere when I decided to head for Ketchikan, normally the Tomcod got up on step and planed along nicely howver with all that weight she wallowed along. It was slow going, which didn't faze me for I more fish than I had caught since I started handtrolling when I was 13, I was totally cranked up. It tokk me over 4 hours to get to the south end of Pennock Island and I knew I was a half hour from the biggest check yet in my fishing carreer when all a sudden the Volvo died. "What the ..... " I looked down at the guages and the gas guage said empty "now what" as I looked around and saw an Alaska state ferry head down the channel. As I drifted I saw another speed boat about my size fishing over by the shore I grabbed an orange life jacket and waved like mad. pretty soon I got their attention they came over and I told them about my predicament as they eyeballed all the coho all over my boat. They hadn't even had a bite so I trade 5 coho for 5 gallons of gas, got the engine running and preceeded up the channel to sell my fish.

Tom

Salty

2008-11-09 05:30:57

Here is another one that involves my mother.

We were trolling on the Homeshore on September 9th in the early 90's and it was fair fishing of about 20-50 or so nice coho a day. I had been fishing mostly at North Pass but decided to come in out of the tide and visit Hoonah on a turn around. It was my practice in those days to often be the last troller on the drag except when I was fishing around Jim Moore on the Aljac who had that position totally staked down.

So, mom and I fished late and then unloaded at a small scow anchored along the beach just North of the Clam flats.

By the time we got unloaded and mom had bought groceries it was totally dark and a little SE was blowing. There was a good fleet anchored on the shore and it was difficult to pick out a spot in the lee with a good distance between boats. I looked around for a bit and picked the best spot I could. After setting the anchor I double checked and the spacing looked a little snug but sufficient.

I fell quickly to a fairly deep sleep because the next thing I knew someone was shining a spotlight through the windows in the pitch black and yelling at me. I had swung too close to a nearby troller and our poles had bumped. I quickly started the engine, pulled the offending pole and then pulled the anchor. It was pitch black, windy, and raining. I started to look for another spot to anchor but since it was about 5:00 am and finding a calm spot with enough room still seemed difficult I decided to go out to the drag and wait for light.

Mother had gotten up during all the commotion and asked what I planned to do next. I said she could hold the wheel and jog back and forth while I got another hour or so of sleep until light. She said if she was going to jog around we might as well have the gear in and she would wake me when we got the first bite. She was always eager to go first thing in the morning which led to my "Rules for Mother when fishing with Eric". But, that is another story for another time. Anyway I grudgingly agreed mostly with the thought that I might get some extra sleep before the first bite.

I had a stern light in those days over the cockpit so we could see the gurdies and snaps. It did not light up the wire over the side very well so we had to feel the marks and then snap the leaders on. I was using mostly glow in the dark hootchies and we used mom's flash camera to take a picture of the gear and charge the glow. Here is an example I took winter fishing:~~[attachment=1]~~Fishing gear_001.jpg[/attachment]

So we were busy putting in the gear in the total dark when mom said;

"Are you hitting bottom?"

"No way, I said, we are in about 70 fathoms."

"I am getting bites" mom exclaimed.

In the next hour or so before and during dawn we pulled 50 coho as I remember. The bite was over before the first boat pulled anchor and came out to the drag. We ended up with about 90 for the whole day as I remember but it was that first hour that made the day and the memory.~~[attachment=0]~~Image00001.jpg[/attachment]

So, they will bite in the dark. Back when I was young and ambitious we often changed to straight glow in the dark hootchies for coho just before dark, took flash pictures of them and fished until the bite stopped. Because we had the glow stuff all set when we finally quit it only made sense to get up early the next morning, re charge them and get a morning bite too. I remember one time in Shelikof when one of my partners who usually highlined me quit a bit early one evening while we fished late. He wandered out the next morning with the rest of the fleet. I know he didn't want to know what he missed so I didn't tell him until he asked. I told him the truth, we got 50 after he quit and 70 before he got up.

Now I am the guy quitting early and starting late. Oh, well. Good thing I figured out how to catch them in the light.

yak2you2

2008-11-10 06:13:45

Sure would be nice if I could figure out how to get winter kings to bite like that, since 3/4's of the day will be dark soon. Often I'll throw out my stuff in the early morning blackness, charging up my glow stuff, and every once in a blue moon I'll pick one up, but not very often,,,and never have I seen a "bite" in the dark. Now that I know that it does happen though, I'm going to keep trying to make it work.

yak2you2

2008-12-08 13:13:38

All right Eric, tell us the " Rules For Mother when fishing with Eric" story, sounds like a good one!

salmontroll

2008-12-09 07:48:37

thanks for the great stories.. you have to love fishing huh? nothing ceases to amaze me.

Salty

2008-12-09 18:47:03

Rule # 1. I talk first in the morning.

For the first few years mom went with me she would always wake up and start talking about what we might do that day. It was fall and I was really enjoying the extra sleep before dawn. Plus, I had no idea usually what I was going to do yet. Mom always had some ideas and wanted to "share and discuss". It made me a bit grouchy engaging in "discussion" about where to start before I was even sure I wanted to go out instead of stay in and go have a great breakfast with Shirley at "Cohos".

Rule# 2. I decide the depth we are fishing, period.

Mom always had ideas on the depth we should fish on various drags which was usually a

bit different than what I had in mind. And when I was napping she would sometimes reset the gear at that depth and then forget to tell me about it when I took over after my nap.

Rule # 3. I decide who our coding partners are and they are the only guys we are coding with.

I came in from the back deck one time and she was just finishing up a conversation on the CB, which didn't have a deck speaker, with Carlos Pedra. I didn't mind her visiting with all her old troller friends on whatever radio and enjoyed the old stories they would tell. But this time she was hurriedly sticking a sheet of paper into her bra.

I said, "What is that"?

Mom said, "Nothing."

But she is a terrible liar. I am sure I inherited that gene.

Anyway I eventually got the sheet and it was a code with Pedra. Pedra is a great guy and I probably would have benefited from coding with him but the idea of mom sharing information secretly really rankled me. Anyway we had quite a disagreement over that one but she eventually saw that it was the skipper who decided the coding partners and we never had problems on that score from then on.~~[attachment=0]~~149.TIF[/attachment]