Bad lower back...
Hoodoo
2011-05-17 19:27:35
Hi guys,
I've been lurking here a bit lately, and wanted first say, this is a great site, with wonderful advice, etc. I'll be relatively quick. I am a fairly fit 32 year old, looking at my 2nd summer as a deckhand, my first year was on a tender, and this 2nd one will be my first as a trolling deckhand.
This past year I've developed a bulging lower disc in my back, primarily from sitting around all day working a 9-5 job the past few years. I'm managing it with exercise and physical therapy, but it's still something I have to watch every day.
My main question regards running gear on a troller. I am trying to determine how much back strain will come with this job. Bending, lifting heavy items while crawling around an engine room, say, are bad things for my back. So is reaching out far and trying to push/pull something. I should say that the boat I'll be on is a freezer troller, so there will be no crawling down into the hold, icing fish for me. It's mostly working in the cockpit, and also standing, fileting fish.
I know over time, people sometimes have issues with their hands from repetitive motion injuries (carpal tunnel, etc.)
But does anyone have any obvious or not-so-obvious tips, for reducing strain on your back? I am hoping that with the right cockpit setup/height, and learning and getting into an efficient rhythm, I will be able to stay healthy and not throw my back out on the first day.
I know obviously everyone is different, and my own experience and body will differ from others, but was just curious what you guys thought.
Thanks so much, again! This is a great site and a great group of people!
SilverT
2011-05-18 20:34:03
Hoodoo,
If you haven't already, make sure you're up front with the skipper. He or she is counting on you in the same way as any functioning piece of equipment and needs to have a plan in place in case you go down. Skippers often love to take a turn in the pit, so learn as much as you can about operating the vessel in case you do need to temporarily switch places.
Purchasing a long gaff ahead of time and cutting it to a comfortable length once you have become familiar with the vessel might minimize strain (take two, as you will probably lose one). Comfortable inserts for your footwear may help, as you will be on your feet a lot. A back support similar to those worn by freight crews in grocery stores might minimize the impacts of some of the movements. Take two gel ice packs, one for the freezer and one for your back and any anti-inflammatory medicine the doc might prescribe. Talk to your therapist about stretches for the specfic movements you anticipate. Finally, you are right on track with the "efficient rhythm." Don't get excited and hurt yourself, as I have in the past.
Take care,
Lane
Hoodoo
2011-05-18 20:58:04
Thanks Lane!
Yeah, I know the skipper real well, and have been talking with him over this past year, about my fitness status and "fears", etc. Good tip about the gel packs, for some reason that hadn't crossed my mind. There will also be a few extra hands on board most of the summer, so we can switch off if needed, once we all get the rhythm down. I figure as long as I can be methodical about it, not get in a hurry, I should be alright.
The biggest thing will be to be careful when lifting all those 50 pound kings over the side all summer, I guess. :)
But seriously, thanks for the advice. My physical therapist told me not to go actually. But, that was a few months back when I was planning on having more of an engineering support role, crawling around the engine room all day, bending over. He was more against the bending over, reaching out and lifting things, while being all contorted. He said that was what was going to get me. He said, that for me, standing while working is probably much better than sitting all day, causes less compression on things.
I also had to describe trolling to him as "like Deadliest Catch, but less intense." So, I probably didn't do a good job of explaining to him what the actual daily routine is really like. Anyway, I have a few more sessions with him before I go, so can see how I do this month, and see if he has any other specific exercises for me to do.
Thanks again!
-Nathan
Hi Nathan:
I can really sympathize with your situation. Lane had some great tips and I'll offer a couple more.
If you are familiar with tens units (if not, your PT will be) there is a small personal model I use called Rhythm Touch 2-Way, which helps with pain relief. I'm sure there are a lot of good systems out there, this is just one I'm familiar with. You can get this one online and the price is variable. They offer lots of attachments, but just the basics will do. It can be too much of a good thing, so you have to test different settings and intensities and use times. Less can be more!
For me, Traumeel is the best of a bazillions of creams I've tried for pain and inflammation - not greasy or smelly (scrub your hands good though, so skipper doesn't worry the fish will smell it=). Same company makes something called Zeel that seems to help on arthritic parts. You can find these at healthfood stores and online. Another pain/inflammation fave is Biofreeze, which you have to get from a healthcare professional. I don't take that on the boat, because it does smell for a short time.
The braces with stays are a little intense to wear all day when moving/twisting, so I use a neoprene brace like you can find in the workout area of a sporting goods store. They offer some support and keep the muscles warm.
Stretch when you get up - during slow times - and end of day. The old school book 'Stretching' by Anderson is easily found online and has suggestions to warm up for various activities.
Don't forget to take those anti-inflammatories with food and lots of water.
Have a great season!
Dale
ATA
Nathan,
I'm 30 and I've suffered from a 'bad back' for more than 5 years. It began when I was in the fish hold of a longliner, bent over, twisting and dragging a ~75lb tub of baited longline gear. Typical 'knocked to the ground, out of breath' back injury story... I think I must have been about 23 at the time. It was real hit and miss for a couple years. Usually I was fine but every once in a while it would go out and I'd be in bed for a day or two. For many years I would basically fish for 6 months and then sit at a computer for 6 months - not a good recipe for a healthy back.
I got into trolling not too long after and eventually wore a lightweight brace all the time and took tons of ibuprofen. After my 3rd season, on the flight home my back was hurting really bad and wouldn't get better - spent two weeks in bed and at one point was about to go to the hospital because I couldn't even get up. I quit fishing and went easy on my back for the next two years, it didn't get better.
Eventually I started physical therapy, quit taking anti-inflammatories, and worked on my posture. Lots of stretching, and I try not to sit a computer for more than an hour or so at a time. My back is not what it once was, but it's better than it's ever been since the initial injury. Still some issues, but nothing like before.
Anyhow what I really wanted to say is taking ibuprofen (or any NSAID) could actually make back problems worse for at least two reasons;
1) Some people are of the opinion that inflammation may actually help with healing by providing more blood flow to the affected area. It's the bodies natural method of dealing with over-stressed tissue. So if you are stopping the bodies healing process...
2) Taking an anti inflammatory drug allows you to do more damage. Consider a common scenario (especially when fishing): A person is working and by 3PM their back is sore, so they take 2 Advil. Thirty minutes later their back feels fine and so back to work they go, causing more injury to the area. Now by the end of the day, the Advil has worn off, their back is really sore and they take 4 Advil. In the morning they get up and, guess what, their back hurts! Take 4 more Advil. What's happening here? The anti inflammatory is masking what this persons body is saying. Which is - "Hey, I'm injured!" - either stop, stretch, have better posture, or better ergonomics in the work you're doing. Something may need to address the issue - but maybe not more Advil.
I think posture is important, and a strong core (front and back) is needed. I know now, when I workout my core, the next day my back feels *better*.
Another thing that helps is physcological... If you're worried a certain portion of your back is going to get hurt, you're probably compensating with surrounding muscles and tensing others. This seems to prolong recovery indefinitely. I didn't make any progress until I realized I needed to relax and let the muscles work as they should. Very hard to do when you've been compensating for a self-made 'weak' area for years!
I hope some of this info is helpful. And let the skipper get those 50lb kings ;)
yak2you2
2011-07-19 12:47:08
I'm 44 years old, been fishing for most of it. I've never really had any back problems, but I'm here to reiterate Jon's thoughts from a different angle. I have problems with my hands. After a few days of big fishing, my hands will get numb at night after I go to bed, and sometimes, they will start aching and throbbing. I too, have done the whole Advil/Aleve merry-go-arond, and it does reach a point where 4 advil just doesn't touch it anymore. Short of developing a narcotic habit, I got pretty desperate to make the problem stop. I started taking a closer look at the daily actions that were causing my issues. Most of the time it had to do with how I was going about cleaning my fish. I finally came up with a rotational program in how how I went about cleaning fish. Did it slow me down? yup, no doubt, but by switching which hands are doing what things just a minute amount differently, I did notice a marked improvement in my pain and swelling level. I'm not sure if I have the dreaded Carpal tunnel syndrome that effects so many fisherman, but i can tell you that we all need to be a lot more aware of how we do things.
The old boys back in the day were tough as nails, but most were all washed up, at my age. If were going to stay active in the fisheries later in life, were going to need all the help we can get.
Hoodoo
2011-07-19 21:57:28
Hi everyone,
Thanks so much for the info., all good to take in. Unfortunately, I've had a couple more "flare ups" over the past few months, and decided against going on the boat this summer. It's pretty frustrating, but I'm just not stable enough right now, to be confident that I could handle the work. And the last thing I wanted to do was get up there, and have something go wrong, and then either get worse by trying to power through it with anti-inflammatories, or be laid up and be a burden to the rest of the guys.
I hear you about taking the drugs too much, probably where I got myself in trouble in the first place. I've been pretty good about staying off the drugs lately, going to physical therapy, sitting properly at work, not sitting too long, doing daily "exercises", all that stuff. It's pretty frustrating that I do all that, and still, about every 3 weeks, I have these flare ups. But, I'm still trying to be proactive and positive about it, getting all the tests, seeing the therapists and doctors, etc. and being aware of what I do all day, finding out what triggers the pain, etc.
It's good to hear the way other people have approached these issues of pain/body management. I'm still hoping that down the road, I'll be good enough to maybe work part of each season, and at least get back into more recreational boating too. I keep thinking of the old timers, like my grandfather, who wouldn't be on here asking about bad backs. However, he was a rather cranky old guy, who had trouble moving around at 50, and had a medicinal six pack a day. So, yeah, if we want to keep messing around with boats and fish as we get older, I guess we have to figure out how to do it without ruining ourselves.